the nsa comes and they tell us our side and tell us their side. tell us how they foiled all these plots. but it turns out when there is a discussion back and forth, we really discover that they did not uniquely use this american surveillance program to get anyone. i think they got most of the terrorists or stopped most of the terrorists if not all of the plots by good old fashioned police work and getting warrants and getting wiretaps on people who they were suspicious of whom they asked a judge about. i'm not against that i'm all for surveillance of spies. i'm just not for this gross bulk gathering of data on all americans. >> john: in fact, you are one of the most strident critics of the program. with congressional hearings, with more congressional oversight into that program, with more duty to report compliance and other aspects of it, would you be comfortable enough with it to let it go ahead? >> you know, i think it would be better with more oversight, but there is some things that they're doing that i fundamentally think are unconstitutional